Difference between revisions of "Philosophy:Theodicy – צדיק ורע לו/2"

From AlHaTorah.org
Jump to navigation Jump to search
Line 29: Line 29:
 
<opinion>Misperception of Retribution
 
<opinion>Misperception of Retribution
 
<p>People aren't actually getting what they seem to be getting.&#160; What seems to us to be a reward or a punishment might not actually be one.</p>
 
<p>People aren't actually getting what they seem to be getting.&#160; What seems to us to be a reward or a punishment might not actually be one.</p>
<mekorot>Third opinion in <multilink><a href="RSaadiaGaonHaEmunotVeHaDeiot5-2-3" data-aht="source">R. Saadia Gaon</a><a href="RSaadiaGaonHaEmunotVeHaDeiot5-2-3" data-aht="source">HaEmunot VeHaDeiot 5:2-3</a><a href="R. Saadia Gaon" data-aht="parshan">About R. Saadia Gaon</a></multilink>, <multilink><a href="ChovotHaLevavot4-3" data-aht="source">Chovot HaLevavot</a><a href="ChovotHaLevavot4-3" data-aht="source">4:3</a><a href="Chovot HaLevavot" data-aht="parshan">About R. Bachya ibn Pakuda</a></multilink>, third opinion in <multilink><a href="RalbagMilchamotHaShem4-5" data-aht="source">Ralbag</a><a href="RalbagMilchamotHaShem4-5" data-aht="source">Milchamot HaShem 4:5</a><a href="RalbagMilchamotHaShem4-6" data-aht="source">Milchamot HaShem 4:6</a><a href="R. Levi b. Gershom (Ralbag, Gersonides)" data-aht="parshan">About R. Levi b. Gershom</a></multilink>,</mekorot>
+
<mekorot>Third opinion in <multilink><a href="RSaadiaGaonHaEmunotVeHaDeiot5-2-3" data-aht="source">R. Saadia Gaon</a><a href="RSaadiaGaonHaEmunotVeHaDeiot5-2-3" data-aht="source">HaEmunot VeHaDeiot 5:2-3</a><a href="R. Saadia Gaon" data-aht="parshan">About R. Saadia Gaon</a></multilink>, third opinion in <multilink><a href="ChovotHaLevavot4-3" data-aht="source">Chovot HaLevavot</a><a href="ChovotHaLevavot4-3" data-aht="source">4:3</a><a href="Chovot HaLevavot" data-aht="parshan">About R. Bachya ibn Pakuda</a></multilink>, third opinion in <multilink><a href="RalbagMilchamotHaShem4-5" data-aht="source">Ralbag</a><a href="RalbagMilchamotHaShem4-5" data-aht="source">Milchamot HaShem 4:5</a><a href="RalbagMilchamotHaShem4-6" data-aht="source">Milchamot HaShem 4:6</a><a href="R. Levi b. Gershom (Ralbag, Gersonides)" data-aht="parshan">About R. Levi b. Gershom</a></multilink>,</mekorot>
 
<point><b>צדיק ורע לו</b><ul>
 
<point><b>צדיק ורע לו</b><ul>
 
<li>Sometimes Hashem causes the righteous to suffer a little in order to avoid him from suffering a lot.</li>
 
<li>Sometimes Hashem causes the righteous to suffer a little in order to avoid him from suffering a lot.</li>
Line 47: Line 47:
 
<category>Compensation in the World to Come
 
<category>Compensation in the World to Come
 
<p>The righteous or wicked man is really not worthy of the retribution they received in this world.&#160; However, in the world to come, Hashem ensures they receive their worthy compensation.</p>
 
<p>The righteous or wicked man is really not worthy of the retribution they received in this world.&#160; However, in the world to come, Hashem ensures they receive their worthy compensation.</p>
<mekorot><multilink><a href="TargumOnkelosDevarim7-10" data-aht="source">Targum Onkelos</a><a href="TargumOnkelosDevarim7-10" data-aht="source">Devarim 7:10</a><a href="Targum Onkelos" data-aht="parshan">About Targum Onkelos</a></multilink>, <multilink><a href="SifreDevarim11-26" data-aht="source">Sifre Devarim</a><a href="SifreDevarim11-26" data-aht="source">11:26</a><a href="Sifre Devarim" data-aht="parshan">About Sifre Devarim</a></multilink>, <multilink><a href="YerushalmiChagigah2-1" data-aht="source">Yerushalmi</a><a href="YerushalmiChagigah2-1" data-aht="source">Chagigah 2:1</a><a href="Talmud Yerushalmi" data-aht="parshan">About the Yerushalmi</a></multilink>, <multilink><a href="BavliShabbat30b" data-aht="source">Bavli</a><a href="BavliShabbat30b" data-aht="source">Shabbat 30b</a><a href="BavliKiddushin40b" data-aht="source">Kiddushin 40b</a><a href="BavliChulin142a" data-aht="source">Chulin 142a</a><a href="Talmud Bavli" data-aht="parshan">About the Bavli</a></multilink>, second opinion in <multilink><a href="RSaadiaGaonHaEmunotVeHaDeiot5-2-3" data-aht="source">R. Saadia Gaon</a><a href="RSaadiaGaonHaEmunotVeHaDeiot5-2-3" data-aht="source">HaEmunot VeHaDeiot 5:2-3</a><a href="R. Saadia Gaon" data-aht="parshan">About R. Saadia Gaon</a></multilink>,<fn>R. Saadia Gaon suggests that the true compensation might occur later in life in this world, and does not explicitly say in the world to come.&#160; He brings as example Iyyov and Paroh who both received at the end of their life, a reward or a punishment, respectively.</fn> <multilink><a href="RashiBerakhot5a" data-aht="source">Rashi</a><a href="RashiBerakhot5a" data-aht="source">Berakhot 5a</a><a href="R. Shelomo Yitzchaki (Rashi)" data-aht="parshan">About R. Shelomo Yitzchaki</a></multilink>, <multilink><a href="Kuzari3-19" data-aht="source">Kuzari</a><a href="Kuzari3-19" data-aht="source">3:19</a><a href="Kuzari6-1" data-aht="source">6:1</a><a href="R. Yehuda HaLevi" data-aht="parshan">About R. Yehuda HaLevi</a></multilink>, <multilink><a href="DerashotHaRan8" data-aht="source">Ran</a><a href="DerashotHaRan8" data-aht="source">Derashot HaRan 8</a><a href="R. Nissim Gerondi (Ran)" data-aht="parshan">About R. Nissim Gerondi</a></multilink>, <multilink><a href="AbarbanelDevarim4-15-24" data-aht="source">Abarbanel</a><a href="AbarbanelDevarim4-15-24" data-aht="source">Devarim 4:15-24</a><a href="AbarbanelDevarim32-1" data-aht="source">Devarim 32:1</a><a href="R. Yitzchak Abarbanel" data-aht="parshan">About R. Yitzchak Abarbanel</a></multilink>,</mekorot>
+
<mekorot><multilink><a href="TargumOnkelosDevarim7-10" data-aht="source">Targum Onkelos</a><a href="TargumOnkelosDevarim7-10" data-aht="source">Devarim 7:10</a><a href="Targum Onkelos" data-aht="parshan">About Targum Onkelos</a></multilink>, <multilink><a href="SifreDevarim11-26" data-aht="source">Sifre Devarim</a><a href="SifreDevarim11-26" data-aht="source">11:26</a><a href="Sifre Devarim" data-aht="parshan">About Sifre Devarim</a></multilink>, <multilink><a href="YerushalmiChagigah2-1" data-aht="source">Yerushalmi</a><a href="YerushalmiChagigah2-1" data-aht="source">Chagigah 2:1</a><a href="Talmud Yerushalmi" data-aht="parshan">About the Yerushalmi</a></multilink>, <multilink><a href="BavliShabbat30b" data-aht="source">Bavli</a><a href="BavliShabbat30b" data-aht="source">Shabbat 30b</a><a href="BavliKiddushin40b" data-aht="source">Kiddushin 40b</a><a href="BavliChulin142a" data-aht="source">Chulin 142a</a><a href="Talmud Bavli" data-aht="parshan">About the Bavli</a></multilink>, second opinion in <multilink><a href="RSaadiaGaonHaEmunotVeHaDeiot5-2-3" data-aht="source">R. Saadia Gaon</a><a href="RSaadiaGaonHaEmunotVeHaDeiot5-2-3" data-aht="source">HaEmunot VeHaDeiot 5:2-3</a><a href="R. Saadia Gaon" data-aht="parshan">About R. Saadia Gaon</a></multilink>,<fn>R. Saadia Gaon suggests that the true compensation might occur later in life in this world, and does not explicitly say in the world to come.&#160; He brings as examples Iyyov and Paroh who both received at the end of their life, a reward or a punishment, respectively.</fn> second opinion in <multilink><a href="ChovotHaLevavot4-3" data-aht="source">Chovot HaLevavot</a><a href="ChovotHaLevavot4-3" data-aht="source">4:3</a><a href="Chovot HaLevavot" data-aht="parshan">About R. Bachya ibn Pakuda</a></multilink>, <multilink><a href="RashiBerakhot5a" data-aht="source">Rashi</a><a href="RashiBerakhot5a" data-aht="source">Berakhot 5a</a><a href="R. Shelomo Yitzchaki (Rashi)" data-aht="parshan">About R. Shelomo Yitzchaki</a></multilink>, <multilink><a href="Kuzari3-19" data-aht="source">Kuzari</a><a href="Kuzari3-19" data-aht="source">3:19</a><a href="Kuzari6-1" data-aht="source">6:1</a><a href="R. Yehuda HaLevi" data-aht="parshan">About R. Yehuda HaLevi</a></multilink>, <multilink><a href="DerashotHaRan8" data-aht="source">Ran</a><a href="DerashotHaRan8" data-aht="source">Derashot HaRan 8</a><a href="R. Nissim Gerondi (Ran)" data-aht="parshan">About R. Nissim Gerondi</a></multilink>, <multilink><a href="AbarbanelDevarim4-15-24" data-aht="source">Abarbanel</a><a href="AbarbanelDevarim4-15-24" data-aht="source">Devarim 4:15-24</a><a href="AbarbanelDevarim32-1" data-aht="source">Devarim 32:1</a><a href="R. Yitzchak Abarbanel" data-aht="parshan">About R. Yitzchak Abarbanel</a></multilink>,</mekorot>
<point><b>צדיק ורע לו</b> The righteous man is being punished over the sins of his generation, or of his ancestors, and not his own sins.</point>
+
<point><b>צדיק ורע לו</b><ul>
 +
<li>The righteous man is suffering over the sins of his generation, or of his ancestors, and not his own sins.</li>
 +
<li>The righteous man is suffering as a test to see if he will continue to follow the right path even though he is compensated wrongly&#160;– R. Saadia.</li>
 +
</ul></point>
 
<point><b>רשע וטוב לו</b> – The wicked man being part of a nation who is worthy of good, receives good as well, even though he does not deserve it.</point>
 
<point><b>רשע וטוב לו</b> – The wicked man being part of a nation who is worthy of good, receives good as well, even though he does not deserve it.</point>
 
<point><b>Moral justification</b> – In the world to come, Hashem will give the real reward to the righteous and the real punishment to the wicked.</point>
 
<point><b>Moral justification</b> – In the world to come, Hashem will give the real reward to the righteous and the real punishment to the wicked.</point>
Line 54: Line 57:
 
<point><b>Purposes of the Egyptian bondage</b> – This approach can understand the Egyptian bondage to have an educative or formative purpose rather than being a punishment for a sin.</point>
 
<point><b>Purposes of the Egyptian bondage</b> – This approach can understand the Egyptian bondage to have an educative or formative purpose rather than being a punishment for a sin.</point>
 
<point><b>Why does Hashem do this?</b><ul>
 
<point><b>Why does Hashem do this?</b><ul>
<li>Natural order&#160;– Hasehm does not purposely wrong people, rather he lets the world act on its own, and therefore some people in this world do not deserve what happens to them.</li>
+
<li><b>Natural order</b>&#160;– Hasehm does not purposely wrong people, rather he lets the world act on its own, and therefore some people in this world do not deserve what happens to them.</li>
<li>Test – The bad events which occur to the righteous man are not intended as a punishment, rather as a test. Hashem knows they will tolerate the punishments even though they don't deserve them, and as a result, He gives them an abundance of good in the future or in the world to come.&#160; To publicize the commitment of the righteous man to Hashem even with all the troubles he goes through.</li>
+
<li><b>Test</b> Hashem is testing the righteous man, knowing they will tolerate the punishment they don't deserve, and later on, He gives them an abundance of good in the future or in the world to come.&#160; Hashem's purpose is to publicize the commitment of the righteous man even with all the troubles he goes through.</li>
 
<li>Hashem is using the wicked man for a different purpose before he punishes him, such as to fight with a different nation.</li>
 
<li>Hashem is using the wicked man for a different purpose before he punishes him, such as to fight with a different nation.</li>
 
</ul></point>
 
</ul></point>
 
<point><b>"פֹּקֵד עֲוֺן אָבוֹת עַל בָּנִים"</b></point>
 
<point><b>"פֹּקֵד עֲוֺן אָבוֹת עַל בָּנִים"</b></point>
<point><b>Iyyov</b></point>
+
<point><b>Iyyov</b> – R. Saadia understands Iyyov's suffering to be a test,<fn>That seems to be the simple reading of the verses, that the Satan wanted to test Iyyov to see if he will continue to worship Hashem even with all his kids dying and his possessions taken.</fn> and as we read at the end of the book, Iyyov got an abundance of good at the end of his life.<fn>See Iyyov 42:12, "וַי"י בֵּרַךְ אֶת אַחֲרִית אִיּוֹב מֵרֵאשִׁתוֹ".</fn></point>
 
<point><b>World to come</b> – This approach is based heavily on the idea of retribution being given in the world to come, however, the whole concept of the world to come is not explicated in the Torah at all.<fn>R. Chasdai Crescas accounts for this question by saying that the nation coming out of Eygpt knew about the world to come and there was no reason to explicate it.</fn></point>
 
<point><b>World to come</b> – This approach is based heavily on the idea of retribution being given in the world to come, however, the whole concept of the world to come is not explicated in the Torah at all.<fn>R. Chasdai Crescas accounts for this question by saying that the nation coming out of Eygpt knew about the world to come and there was no reason to explicate it.</fn></point>
 
<point><b>Afflictions of love</b> – This approach understands that Hashem sometimes afflicts out of love to the person in order to multiply their reward, and not as a punishment over a sin.</point>
 
<point><b>Afflictions of love</b> – This approach understands that Hashem sometimes afflicts out of love to the person in order to multiply their reward, and not as a punishment over a sin.</point>

Version as of 09:28, 24 July 2017

Theodicy – צדיק ורע לו

Exegetical Approaches

This topic has not yet undergone editorial review

Compensation in This World

This approach denies the question saying that there are no cases of innocent people being punished or wicked people being rewarded.  In all such seeming cases, one needs to reevaluate either the person's righteousness or their compensation.

Mistaken Status of Person

People don't deserve what they seem to deserve.  A man might seem to be righteous or wicked, however, he might not always actually be so, and Hashem is really paying him his true due that he deserves.

צדיק ורע לו – As outsiders, we can never truly know whether a person is totally righteous.  In these cases he must not be truly innocent, and Hashem is punishing him for the few sins that he committed, even if the majority of his actions were right.
  • R. Bachya suggests that their sin could be in not convincing their generation to repent, even if they themselves did not commit any sins.
  • On the other hand, Ramban says suffering can come as a punishment for a sin committed accidentally.
רשע וטוב לו – The wicked man also performed some good deeds in his life, for which he is being rewarded.  R. Saadia, followed by R. Bachya, accounts for some cases where it doesn't seem as clear that good deeds were done, by saying Hashem is rewarding the wicked man since there is always a possibility that he will repent and be worthy of the reward in the future.
Moral justification – This approach claims that almost all humans are neither perfect nor terrible, rather everyone is somewhere in the middle, and that is how one can have a seemingly pious person who is being punished and the opposite as well.  However, this approach does not account for the many cases where the compensation does not seem exact, and a man who might have committed just one small sin, seems to be punished for far more than that.
Hashem's providence – This approach maintains that Hashem provides for every individual, and not just on a national level.  These sources say that justice works the way Torah describes it, every man is punished for all his sins and rewarded for all his positive deeds.
World to come – These commentators hold that no undeserved retribution is given in this world, however, the deserved retribution sometimes is only given in the world to come.  Therefore, in some cases, already in this world Hashem ensures to pay off for any good deeds performed, so in the world to come they will be worthy of only punishments.
Afflictions of love – Ramban understands that all affliction of love come as a punishment for a sin.
Prophetic complaints – Ramban explains that the prophets were not questioning whether Hashem was acting justly, rather it was a way of complaining about their fate.3
Iyyov – The story of Iyyov seems to contradict this approach, since we don't hear from the book that Iyyov committed any sins.  Ramban understands
Collective punishment – This approach believes that every man is punished for his own sins.  The fact one person might have done something wrong does not require anyone else besides himself to be punished.
"פֹּקֵד עֲוֺן אָבוֹת עַל בָּנִים"

Misperception of Retribution

People aren't actually getting what they seem to be getting.  What seems to us to be a reward or a punishment might not actually be one.

צדיק ורע לו
  • Sometimes Hashem causes the righteous to suffer a little in order to avoid him from suffering a lot.
רשע וטוב לו
  • Sometimes Hashem keeps the wicked person alive in order for them to witness an even worse punishment than they would have witnessed.
  • In some cases, the good is a cause for bad, and the whole purpose really is the punishment.  For example by Paroh, Hashem did not punish him in order so he will experience the splitting of the sea which was a harsher punishment than he would have received.
Moral justification
Hashem's providence – According to this approach, not all good and evil in life is necessarily a punishment or a reward.
World to come
Afflictions of love
Prophetic complaints – R. Saadia suggests the prophets trusted Hashem he is directing the world justly, rather they were just asking how and for what purpose he was doing what looks to be unjust.4
Iyyov

Compensation in the World to Come

The righteous or wicked man is really not worthy of the retribution they received in this world.  However, in the world to come, Hashem ensures they receive their worthy compensation.

צדיק ורע לו
  • The righteous man is suffering over the sins of his generation, or of his ancestors, and not his own sins.
  • The righteous man is suffering as a test to see if he will continue to follow the right path even though he is compensated wrongly – R. Saadia.
רשע וטוב לו – The wicked man being part of a nation who is worthy of good, receives good as well, even though he does not deserve it.
Moral justification – In the world to come, Hashem will give the real reward to the righteous and the real punishment to the wicked.
Hashem's providence – According to this approach, Hashem provides on a national level, and not for each individual person.
Purposes of the Egyptian bondage – This approach can understand the Egyptian bondage to have an educative or formative purpose rather than being a punishment for a sin.
Why does Hashem do this?
  • Natural order – Hasehm does not purposely wrong people, rather he lets the world act on its own, and therefore some people in this world do not deserve what happens to them.
  • Test – Hashem is testing the righteous man, knowing they will tolerate the punishment they don't deserve, and later on, He gives them an abundance of good in the future or in the world to come.  Hashem's purpose is to publicize the commitment of the righteous man even with all the troubles he goes through.
  • Hashem is using the wicked man for a different purpose before he punishes him, such as to fight with a different nation.
"פֹּקֵד עֲוֺן אָבוֹת עַל בָּנִים"
Iyyov – R. Saadia understands Iyyov's suffering to be a test,6 and as we read at the end of the book, Iyyov got an abundance of good at the end of his life.7
World to come – This approach is based heavily on the idea of retribution being given in the world to come, however, the whole concept of the world to come is not explicated in the Torah at all.8
Afflictions of love – This approach understands that Hashem sometimes afflicts out of love to the person in order to multiply their reward, and not as a punishment over a sin.