Difference between revisions of "Concerns Regarding the Monarchy/2"

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<multilink><a href="BavliSanhedrin20b" data-aht="source">R. Eliezer in Bavli Sanhedrin</a><a href="BavliSanhedrin20b" data-aht="source">Sanhedrin 20b</a><a href="Talmud Bavli" data-aht="parshan">About the Bavli</a></multilink> according to <multilink><a href="RashiSanhedrin20b" data-aht="source">Rashi</a><a href="RashiSanhedrin20b" data-aht="source">Sanhedrin 20b</a><a href="R. Shelomo Yitzchaki (Rashi)" data-aht="parshan">About R. Shelomo Yitzchaki</a></multilink>, <multilink><a href="RadakShemuelI8-5820" data-aht="source">Radak</a><a href="RadakShemuelI8-5820" data-aht="source">Shemuel I 8:5, 8, 20</a><a href="R. David Kimchi (Radak)" data-aht="parshan">About R. David Kimchi</a></multilink>, Prof. Y. Elitzur
 
<multilink><a href="BavliSanhedrin20b" data-aht="source">R. Eliezer in Bavli Sanhedrin</a><a href="BavliSanhedrin20b" data-aht="source">Sanhedrin 20b</a><a href="Talmud Bavli" data-aht="parshan">About the Bavli</a></multilink> according to <multilink><a href="RashiSanhedrin20b" data-aht="source">Rashi</a><a href="RashiSanhedrin20b" data-aht="source">Sanhedrin 20b</a><a href="R. Shelomo Yitzchaki (Rashi)" data-aht="parshan">About R. Shelomo Yitzchaki</a></multilink>, <multilink><a href="RadakShemuelI8-5820" data-aht="source">Radak</a><a href="RadakShemuelI8-5820" data-aht="source">Shemuel I 8:5, 8, 20</a><a href="R. David Kimchi (Radak)" data-aht="parshan">About R. David Kimchi</a></multilink>, Prof. Y. Elitzur
 
</mekorot>
 
</mekorot>
<point><b>"וְיָצָא לְפָנֵינוּ וְנִלְחַם אֶת מִלְחֲמֹתֵנוּ"</b> – Rashi and Radak point to these words of the nation as evidence that the people were not requesting a king who would serve a judicial purpose, but rather for someone to act as a military leader. They claim that this focus on the military aspect of the king's leadership is what troubled Hashem.</point>
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<point><b>"וְיָצָא לְפָנֵינוּ וְנִלְחַם אֶת מִלְחֲמֹתֵנוּ"</b> – Rashi and Radak point to these words of the nation as evidence that the people were not requesting a king who would serve a judicial purpose, but rather one who would act in a military capacity. They claim that this focus on the military aspect of the king's leadership is what troubled Hashem.</point>
 
<point><b>"שִׂימָה לָּנוּ מֶלֶךְ לְשׇׁפְטֵנוּ"</b> – One might argue that in their initial request, the people actually make no mention of any military role, but only a judicial one (לְשׇׁפְטֵנוּ). Prof. Elitzur responds that the people were using the verb "שפט" in the military sense of the word,<fn>See also Radak's second possibility in explaining the word&#160; "וּשְׁפָטָנוּ" in verse 22: "או פירושו יקח משפטינו מיד אויבינו".&#160; According to this understanding, the last two clauses of the verse, ",וְיָצָא לְפָנֵינוּ וְנִלְחַם אֶת מִלְחֲמֹתֵנוּ" clarify what is meant by the initial phrase, "וּשְׁפָטָנוּ מַלְכֵּנוּ" .</fn> asking for a king who would serve as a שופט, like the leaders of the Book of Judges who were mainly saviors in war.</point>
 
<point><b>"שִׂימָה לָּנוּ מֶלֶךְ לְשׇׁפְטֵנוּ"</b> – One might argue that in their initial request, the people actually make no mention of any military role, but only a judicial one (לְשׇׁפְטֵנוּ). Prof. Elitzur responds that the people were using the verb "שפט" in the military sense of the word,<fn>See also Radak's second possibility in explaining the word&#160; "וּשְׁפָטָנוּ" in verse 22: "או פירושו יקח משפטינו מיד אויבינו".&#160; According to this understanding, the last two clauses of the verse, ",וְיָצָא לְפָנֵינוּ וְנִלְחַם אֶת מִלְחֲמֹתֵנוּ" clarify what is meant by the initial phrase, "וּשְׁפָטָנוּ מַלְכֵּנוּ" .</fn> asking for a king who would serve as a שופט, like the leaders of the Book of Judges who were mainly saviors in war.</point>
 
<point><b>What is wrong with desiring a military leader?</b><ul>
 
<point><b>What is wrong with desiring a military leader?</b><ul>
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<point><b>Comparison to idolatry</b> – Since the monarchy means that the people depend on their king rather than Hashem, it is similar to idolatry.<fn>See Rashbam on Shemot 16:4 who similarly points out that dependence on Hashem instills belief in Him.</fn>&#160; It, too, will eventually lead the people to forsake Hashem.</point>
 
<point><b>Comparison to idolatry</b> – Since the monarchy means that the people depend on their king rather than Hashem, it is similar to idolatry.<fn>See Rashbam on Shemot 16:4 who similarly points out that dependence on Hashem instills belief in Him.</fn>&#160; It, too, will eventually lead the people to forsake Hashem.</point>
 
<point><b>"כֵּן הֵמָּה עֹשִׂים גַּם לָךְ"</b> – According to Radak, in these words Hashem tells Shemuel that the people actually did rebel against the prophet as well, but in his military rather than judicial role.&#160; Until now the prophet had led them in battle by bringing them back to Hashem.&#160; In fact, he was so successful that they were hardly threatened by war anymore. Thus, in asking for a king, the people were rejecting both Hashem and Shemuel.</point>
 
<point><b>"כֵּן הֵמָּה עֹשִׂים גַּם לָךְ"</b> – According to Radak, in these words Hashem tells Shemuel that the people actually did rebel against the prophet as well, but in his military rather than judicial role.&#160; Until now the prophet had led them in battle by bringing them back to Hashem.&#160; In fact, he was so successful that they were hardly threatened by war anymore. Thus, in asking for a king, the people were rejecting both Hashem and Shemuel.</point>
<point><b>Laws in Devarim</b><ul>
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<point><b>Positive mentions of monarchy</b><ul>
 
<li>Prof Elitzur claims that the Torah is not against monarchy per se, only against the hopes the people put into the change of regime.<fn>It was their assumptions that changing their ruler, rather than changing their ways,&#160; would make them victorious in battle and usher in peace, that was problematic.</fn></li>
 
<li>Prof Elitzur claims that the Torah is not against monarchy per se, only against the hopes the people put into the change of regime.<fn>It was their assumptions that changing their ruler, rather than changing their ways,&#160; would make them victorious in battle and usher in peace, that was problematic.</fn></li>
<li>Alternatively, in Devarim Hashem is referring to a king whose primary role was not military in nature but judicial or spiritual. Such a monarch would not have been problematic, yet, even so, Hashem enacts laws to curb his power and remind him that he is subservient to Hashem.&#160; Otherwise there is a fear that he will become haughty and see himself as a replacement for Hashem, leading him and the nation to depend on the monarch and not God.</li>
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<li>Alternatively, in Devarim (and elsewhere) Hashem is referring to a king whose primary role was not military in nature but judicial or spiritual. Such a monarch would not have been problematic, yet, even so, Hashem enacts laws to curb his power and remind him that he is subservient to Hashem.&#160; Otherwise there is a fear that he will become haughty and see himself as a replacement for Hashem, leading him and the nation to depend on the monarch and not God.</li>
 
</ul></point>
 
</ul></point>
<point><b>Shemeul's speech when anointing Shaul</b> – When Shemuel appoints Shaul as king, he reminds the people that it is Hashem, not their new king, who is their true savior:&#160; "וְאַתֶּם הַיּוֹם מְאַסְתֶּם אֶת אֱלֹהֵיכֶם אֲשֶׁר <b>הוּא מוֹשִׁיעַ</b> לָכֶם מִכׇּל רָעוֹתֵיכֶם וְצָרֹתֵיכֶם וַתֹּאמְרוּ לוֹ כִּי מֶלֶךְ תָּשִׂים עָלֵינוּ" (<a href="ShemuelI10-18-20" data-aht="source">Shemuel I 10:18-20</a>). This further supports this position's understanding of the people's flawed request.</point>
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<point><b>Shemuel's speech when anointing Shaul</b> – When Shemuel appoints Shaul as king, he reminds the people that it is Hashem, not their new king, who is their true savior:&#160; "וְאַתֶּם הַיּוֹם מְאַסְתֶּם אֶת אֱלֹהֵיכֶם אֲשֶׁר <b>הוּא מוֹשִׁיעַ</b> לָכֶם מִכׇּל רָעוֹתֵיכֶם וְצָרֹתֵיכֶם וַתֹּאמְרוּ לוֹ כִּי מֶלֶךְ תָּשִׂים עָלֵינוּ" (<a href="ShemuelI10-18-20" data-aht="source">Shemuel I 10:18-20</a>). This further supports this position's understanding of the people's flawed request.</point>
<point><b>Shemuel's speech in Chapter 12</b> – Throughout his speech, Shemuel brings examples of how, in the past, when the Israelites found themselves in danger, they would cry out to Hashem, recognizing that they had sinned. This, he hints, is what they were supposed to do. Similarly, Shemuel might intentionally bring a sign from non-seasonal rain since, in Torah, rain and the lack thereof is a barometer of the people's observance of Hashem's commandments and a reminder of our dependence upon Him.</point>
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<point><b>Shemuel's speech in Chapter 12</b> – Throughout his speech, Shemuel brings examples of how, in the past, when the Israelites found themselves in danger, they would cry out to Hashem, recognizing that they had sinned. This, he hints, is what they were supposed to do. Similarly, Shemuel might intentionally bring a sign from non-seasonal rain since, in Torah, rain and the lack thereof is a barometer of the people's observance of Hashem's commandments (the true reason for military success) and a reminder of our dependence upon Him.</point>
 
<point><b>Parallel to Gidon</b> – After Gidon's victory over Midyan, the people make the same mistake they do here, requesting that Gidon lead them as king because "you saved us from Midyan".&#160; Gidon refuses, teaching the nation: "לֹא אֶמְשֹׁל אֲנִי בָּכֶם וְלֹא יִמְשֹׁל בְּנִי בָּכֶם י"י יִמְשֹׁל בָּכֶם" (<a href="Shofetim8-22-23" data-aht="source">Shofetim 8:22-23</a>).</point>
 
<point><b>Parallel to Gidon</b> – After Gidon's victory over Midyan, the people make the same mistake they do here, requesting that Gidon lead them as king because "you saved us from Midyan".&#160; Gidon refuses, teaching the nation: "לֹא אֶמְשֹׁל אֲנִי בָּכֶם וְלֹא יִמְשֹׁל בְּנִי בָּכֶם י"י יִמְשֹׁל בָּכֶם" (<a href="Shofetim8-22-23" data-aht="source">Shofetim 8:22-23</a>).</point>
<point><b>Mishpat haMelekh</b></point>
 
 
<point><b>Granting a king</b> – If Hashem thought that having a military-monarch was dangerous for the people spiritually, it is not clear why He agreed to the request.</point>
 
<point><b>Granting a king</b> – If Hashem thought that having a military-monarch was dangerous for the people spiritually, it is not clear why He agreed to the request.</point>
 
</category>
 
</category>
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<point><b>"לְשׇׁפְטֵנוּ"</b> – These sources all pick up on the nation's request "שִׂימָה לָּנוּ מֶלֶךְ <b>לְשׇׁפְטֵנוּ</b>", claiming that Shemuel is upset specifically by the people's request&#160; for a king who "will judge us."<fn>The Malbim points out that had they asked for a king without elaboration or for a military leader, that would not have been problematic.</fn></point>
 
<point><b>"לְשׇׁפְטֵנוּ"</b> – These sources all pick up on the nation's request "שִׂימָה לָּנוּ מֶלֶךְ <b>לְשׇׁפְטֵנוּ</b>", claiming that Shemuel is upset specifically by the people's request&#160; for a king who "will judge us."<fn>The Malbim points out that had they asked for a king without elaboration or for a military leader, that would not have been problematic.</fn></point>
 
<point><b>Shemuel's sons</b> – The fact that the people preface their request for a king with their complaints about Shemuel's sons not following in their father's way,<fn>The Rambam asserts that had they, in contrast, requested&#160; a king so as to fulfill the commandment, that would have been commendable.</fn> supports the idea that their request for a king stemmed from a desire to replace Shemuel and his family.<fn>Hoil Moshe points to an inconsistency&#160; in the nation's request which proves that their motives were not pure.&#160; The people complain about Shemuel's sons not following in his ways, but nonetheless ask specifically for a dynastic ruler where the same issue of an unfit son inheriting the position is likely!&#160; This proved to Shemuel that the people were simply looking to reject him and his family.</fn></point>
 
<point><b>Shemuel's sons</b> – The fact that the people preface their request for a king with their complaints about Shemuel's sons not following in their father's way,<fn>The Rambam asserts that had they, in contrast, requested&#160; a king so as to fulfill the commandment, that would have been commendable.</fn> supports the idea that their request for a king stemmed from a desire to replace Shemuel and his family.<fn>Hoil Moshe points to an inconsistency&#160; in the nation's request which proves that their motives were not pure.&#160; The people complain about Shemuel's sons not following in his ways, but nonetheless ask specifically for a dynastic ruler where the same issue of an unfit son inheriting the position is likely!&#160; This proved to Shemuel that the people were simply looking to reject him and his family.</fn></point>
<point><b>Shemuel's speech in chapter 12</b> – The first half of Shemuel's speech is devoted to Shemuel's insistence that he was always honest in his dealings with the nation.&#160; This focus supports the idea that Shemuel had felt that the people doubted his abilities and functioning as a shofet.</point>
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<point><b>Shemuel's speech in Chapter 12</b> – The first half of Shemuel's speech is devoted to Shemuel's insistence that he was always honest in his dealings with the nation.&#160; This focus further supports the idea that Shemuel had felt that the people doubted his abilities and functioning as a judge.</point>
 
<point><b>"כְּכָל הַגּוֹיִם"</b> – These sources see nothing wrong in the desire "to be like the nations". After all, in Devarim when Hashem speaks of appointing a king, He Himself says that the people will request a king "like all the nations".&#160; Moreover, if this was problematic either Shemuel or Hashem should have emphasized that aspect of the request in their speech.</point>
 
<point><b>"כְּכָל הַגּוֹיִם"</b> – These sources see nothing wrong in the desire "to be like the nations". After all, in Devarim when Hashem speaks of appointing a king, He Himself says that the people will request a king "like all the nations".&#160; Moreover, if this was problematic either Shemuel or Hashem should have emphasized that aspect of the request in their speech.</point>
<point><b>Hashem's response: "כִּי אֹתִי מָאֲסוּ"</b> – Hashem's response to Shemuel "כִּי לֹא אֹתְךָ מָאָסוּ כִּי אֹתִי מָאֲסוּ" would seem to go against this position as it suggests that Hashem does not see in the nation's request an affront to Shemuel.&#160; The Hoil Moshe explains that Hashem isn't denying the insult, but comforting Shemuel by telling him that the people treat Hashem the same way, constantly turning away from Him and choosing idols in His place.&#160; Thus, Shemuel should not take it unduly to heart:&#160; "דיו לעבד שיהיה כרבו".&#160; Hoil Moshe further proves that Hashem isn't trying to dismiss Shemuel concerns from His final words, "כֵּן הֵמָּה עֹשִׂים <b>גַּם לָךְ</b>".</point>
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<point><b>Hashem's response: "כִּי אֹתִי מָאֲסוּ"</b> – Hashem's response to Shemuel "כִּי לֹא אֹתְךָ מָאָסוּ כִּי אֹתִי מָאֲסוּ" would seem to go against this position as it suggests that Hashem does not see in the nation's request an affront to Shemuel.&#160; The Hoil Moshe explains that Hashem isn't denying the insult, but comforting Shemuel by telling him that the people treat Hashem the same way, constantly turning away from Him and choosing idols in His place.&#160; Thus, Shemuel should not take it unduly to heart:&#160; "דיו לעבד שיהיה כרבו".&#160; Hoil Moshe further proves that Hashem isn't trying to dismiss Shemuel's concerns from His final words, "כֵּן הֵמָּה עֹשִׂים <b>גַּם לָךְ</b>".</point>
 
<point><b>Positive mentions of monarchy</b> – The fact that monarchy is viewed positively in Torah and the Book of Judges is not problematic for this position as these sources agree that the monarchy is a desired institution.&#160; In Sefer Shemuel, the anger at the nation comes not from the content of the people's request but from the manner in which they ask it.</point>
 
<point><b>Positive mentions of monarchy</b> – The fact that monarchy is viewed positively in Torah and the Book of Judges is not problematic for this position as these sources agree that the monarchy is a desired institution.&#160; In Sefer Shemuel, the anger at the nation comes not from the content of the people's request but from the manner in which they ask it.</point>
 
<point><b>Granting a king</b> – Hashem granted the request since there was really nothing wrong with asking for a monarch.&#160; The people's sin was only an interpersonal one.</point>
 
<point><b>Granting a king</b> – Hashem granted the request since there was really nothing wrong with asking for a monarch.&#160; The people's sin was only an interpersonal one.</point>
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</mekorot>
 
</mekorot>
 
<point><b>"לְשׇׁפְטֵנוּ"</b> – As above, these sources note that Shemuel focuses specifically on the nation's request "שִׂימָה לָּנוּ מֶלֶךְ <b>לְשׇׁפְטֵנוּ</b>", proving that what he found problematic was the desire for a king who "will judge us."<fn><sup id="reffn9" class="fnRef mceNonEditable"><a class="ahtNonEditable" href="#fn9">9</a></sup></fn></point>
 
<point><b>"לְשׇׁפְטֵנוּ"</b> – As above, these sources note that Shemuel focuses specifically on the nation's request "שִׂימָה לָּנוּ מֶלֶךְ <b>לְשׇׁפְטֵנוּ</b>", proving that what he found problematic was the desire for a king who "will judge us."<fn><sup id="reffn9" class="fnRef mceNonEditable"><a class="ahtNonEditable" href="#fn9">9</a></sup></fn></point>
<point><b>Shemuel's sons</b> – The people;s request for a king comes on the back of their complaints about Shemuel's sons.&#160; This further supports the assertion that they desired a king who would serve in the capacity of judge.</point>
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<point><b>Shemuel's sons</b> – The people's request for a king comes on the back of their complaints about Shemuel's sons.&#160; This further supports the assertion that they desired a king who would serve in the capacity of judge.</point>
 
<point><b>What is wrong with a king who judges?</b> The Ran explains that a king's tasks are political and military, while the judge's job is spiritual.&#160; The latter necessitates having a Divine spark (ענין אלהי) which the monarch might be lacking.&#160; As such, the two positions were meant to remain distinct.<fn>Ibn Kapsi points out that in Torah these constitute two separate commandments, "שֹׁפְטִים וְשֹׁטְרִים תִּתֶּן לְךָ בְּכׇל שְׁעָרֶיךָ" (Devarim 16) and "שׂוֹם תָּשִׂים עָלֶיךָ מֶלֶךְ" (Devarim 17)</fn></point>
 
<point><b>What is wrong with a king who judges?</b> The Ran explains that a king's tasks are political and military, while the judge's job is spiritual.&#160; The latter necessitates having a Divine spark (ענין אלהי) which the monarch might be lacking.&#160; As such, the two positions were meant to remain distinct.<fn>Ibn Kapsi points out that in Torah these constitute two separate commandments, "שֹׁפְטִים וְשֹׁטְרִים תִּתֶּן לְךָ בְּכׇל שְׁעָרֶיךָ" (Devarim 16) and "שׂוֹם תָּשִׂים עָלֶיךָ מֶלֶךְ" (Devarim 17)</fn></point>
 
<point><b>"כְּכָל הַגּוֹיִם"</b> – According to this approach neither Shemuel nor Hashem were upset by the nation's choice of language, "to be like the nations".</point>
 
<point><b>"כְּכָל הַגּוֹיִם"</b> – According to this approach neither Shemuel nor Hashem were upset by the nation's choice of language, "to be like the nations".</point>
 
<point><b>Hashem's response: "כִּי אֹתִי מָאֲסוּ"</b> – The Ran explains that Hashem is telling Shemuel that in asking for a purely political ruler to take on a spiritual role, the people were denying the need for a "Divine spark" and thus rejecting Hashem.</point>
 
<point><b>Hashem's response: "כִּי אֹתִי מָאֲסוּ"</b> – The Ran explains that Hashem is telling Shemuel that in asking for a purely political ruler to take on a spiritual role, the people were denying the need for a "Divine spark" and thus rejecting Hashem.</point>
<point><b>Monarchy in Devarim</b> – Ibn Kaspi points out that since&#160;<a href="Devarim16-18-20" data-aht="source">Devarim 16</a> and&#160;<a href="Devarim17-14" data-aht="source">Devarim 17</a> speak of two distinct institutions, that of judges and that of kings, it is evident that an Israelite monarch was not supposed to serve as both.&#160; Had the people asked for a king without elaboration, or one that would serve a military role, Shemuel and Hashem would not have resisted, since that was the original intention and command.<fn>These sources would likely explain that other places in Tanakh where the monarchy is viewed positively are speaking of an institution which is not judicial in nature.</fn></point>
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<point><b>Monarchy in Devarim</b> – Ibn Kaspi points out that since&#160;<a href="Devarim16-18-20" data-aht="source">Devarim 16</a> and&#160;<a href="Devarim17-14" data-aht="source">Devarim 17</a> speak of two distinct institutions, that of judges and that of kings, it is evident that an Israelite monarch was not supposed to serve as both.&#160; Had the people asked for a king without elaboration, or one that would serve a military role, Shemuel and Hashem would not have resisted, since that was the original intention and command.<fn>These sources would likely explain that other places in Tanakh where the monarchy is viewed positively are similarly speaking of an institution which is not judicial in nature.</fn></point>
 
<point><b>Shemuel's speech in Chapter 12</b> – Shemuel focuses much of his speech on his honest dealings as judge, perhaps to highlight to the people what they will be missing when they have a politically minded king play that role in his stead.&#160; The Ran suggests that Shemuel brings a miraculous sign (a thunderstorm out of season) to show that an individual with a Divine park is not subject to the laws of nature, again highlighting what a judge-king will lack.</point>
 
<point><b>Shemuel's speech in Chapter 12</b> – Shemuel focuses much of his speech on his honest dealings as judge, perhaps to highlight to the people what they will be missing when they have a politically minded king play that role in his stead.&#160; The Ran suggests that Shemuel brings a miraculous sign (a thunderstorm out of season) to show that an individual with a Divine park is not subject to the laws of nature, again highlighting what a judge-king will lack.</point>
 
<point><b>Granting a king</b> – According to the Ran, after Shemeul's rebuke, the people changed their request, this time adding that the king must play a military role: "וְיָצָא לְפָנֵינוּ וְנִלְחַם אֶת מִלְחֲמֹתֵנוּ". Though they were not willing to totally forego a judge-king, they at least made concessions due to Shemuel's rebuke, and so Hashem granted their request.</point>
 
<point><b>Granting a king</b> – According to the Ran, after Shemeul's rebuke, the people changed their request, this time adding that the king must play a military role: "וְיָצָא לְפָנֵינוּ וְנִלְחַם אֶת מִלְחֲמֹתֵנוּ". Though they were not willing to totally forego a judge-king, they at least made concessions due to Shemuel's rebuke, and so Hashem granted their request.</point>
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<multilink><a href="SifreDevarim156" data-aht="source">R. Nehorai in Sifre Devarim</a><a href="SifreDevarim156" data-aht="source">156</a><a href="Sifre Devarim" data-aht="parshan">About Sifre Devarim</a></multilink>,<multilink><a href="RalbagShemuelI8-4" data-aht="source"> Ralbag</a><a href="RalbagShemuelI8-4" data-aht="source">Shemuel I 8:4</a><a href="R. Levi b. Gershom (Ralbag, Gersonides)" data-aht="parshan">About R. Levi b. Gershom</a></multilink>, <multilink><a href="AbarbanelShemuelI8-4" data-aht="source">bishop cited by Abarbanel</a><a href="AbarbanelShemuelI8-4" data-aht="source">Shemuel I 8:4-6</a><a href="R. Yitzchak Abarbanel" data-aht="parshan">About R. Yitzchak Abarbanel</a></multilink>, <multilink><a href="MalbimShemuelI8-6" data-aht="source">Malbim #3</a><a href="MalbimShemuelI8-6" data-aht="source">Shemuel I 8:6</a><a href="R. Meir Leibush Weiser (Malbim)" data-aht="parshan">About R. Meir Leibush Weiser</a></multilink>
 
<multilink><a href="SifreDevarim156" data-aht="source">R. Nehorai in Sifre Devarim</a><a href="SifreDevarim156" data-aht="source">156</a><a href="Sifre Devarim" data-aht="parshan">About Sifre Devarim</a></multilink>,<multilink><a href="RalbagShemuelI8-4" data-aht="source"> Ralbag</a><a href="RalbagShemuelI8-4" data-aht="source">Shemuel I 8:4</a><a href="R. Levi b. Gershom (Ralbag, Gersonides)" data-aht="parshan">About R. Levi b. Gershom</a></multilink>, <multilink><a href="AbarbanelShemuelI8-4" data-aht="source">bishop cited by Abarbanel</a><a href="AbarbanelShemuelI8-4" data-aht="source">Shemuel I 8:4-6</a><a href="R. Yitzchak Abarbanel" data-aht="parshan">About R. Yitzchak Abarbanel</a></multilink>, <multilink><a href="MalbimShemuelI8-6" data-aht="source">Malbim #3</a><a href="MalbimShemuelI8-6" data-aht="source">Shemuel I 8:6</a><a href="R. Meir Leibush Weiser (Malbim)" data-aht="parshan">About R. Meir Leibush Weiser</a></multilink>
 
</mekorot>
 
</mekorot>
<point><b>"כְּכָל הַגּוֹיִם"</b> – These sources focus on the people's request that they have a king "like the other nations," understanding this to mean that they desired a king who would act like Gentile rulers, deciding the law on his own rather than following Torah law.&#160; Thus, while the Torah speaks of a constitutional monarchy, the people requested an absolute monarchy.</point>
+
<point><b>"כְּכָל הַגּוֹיִם"</b> – These sources focus on the people's request that they have a king "like the other nations," understanding this to mean that they desired a king who would act like Gentile rulers, deciding the law on his own rather than following Torah law.<fn>R. Nehorai focuses only on the fact that the king will be idolatrous.</fn>&#160; Thus, while the Torah speaks of a constitutional monarchy, the people requested an absolute monarchy.</point>
<point><b>The command to appoint a king in Devarim</b> – One may question how asking to be "like the nations" could be problematic if Hashem uses the very same language when speaking of anointing a king in <a href="Devarim17-14" data-aht="source">Devarim</a>. Malbim responds that in Devarim, the phrase "כְּכׇל הַגּוֹיִם" refers to the words "אָשִׂימָה עָלַי מֶלֶךְ" so Hashem is simply saying that the people will want to have a monarch, just as other nations have such a leader.&#160; In Shemuel, however, the words "כְּכׇל הַגּוֹיִם" refer back to the verb "לְשׇׁפְטֵנוּ" which changes the people's intent totally, for here they are instead asking for a king whose<i> judgement</i> will be like that of other nations.</point>
+
<point><b>The command to appoint a king in Devarim</b> – One may question how asking to be "like the nations" could be problematic if Hashem uses the very same language when speaking of anointing a king in <a href="Devarim17-14" data-aht="source">Devarim</a>. Malbim responds that in Devarim, the phrase "כְּכׇל הַגּוֹיִם" is linked to the words "אָשִׂימָה עָלַי מֶלֶךְ" so Hashem is simply saying that the people will want to appoint a monarch just as other nations have such a leader.&#160; In Shemuel, however, the words "כְּכׇל הַגּוֹיִם" refer back to the verb "לְשׇׁפְטֵנוּ" which changes the people's intent totally, for here they are instead asking for a king whose<i> judgement</i> will be like that of other nations.</point>
<point><b>"לְשׇׁפְטֵנוּ"</b> – This approach must explain why, when the verses describes Shemuel's distress at the people's request, they make no mention of the fact that the nation desired a king "like all the nations" emphasizing instead that they wanted one to "judge" them. These sources respond that Shemuel mentions the aspect of judgement, since this is the area in which the king won't be abiding by Torah law, as he will, instead, be making his own משפט.</point>
+
<point><b>"לְשׇׁפְטֵנוּ"</b> – This approach must explain why, when the verses describes Shemuel's distress at the people's request, they make no mention of the fact that the nation desired a king "like all the nations" emphasizing instead that they wanted one to "judge" them. These sources respond that Shemuel mentions the aspect of judgement, since this is the area in which the king won't be abiding by Torah law, as he will, instead, be making his own code.</point>
 
<point><b>Hashem's response: "כִּי אֹתִי מָאֲסוּ"</b> – In choosing a king who won't follow the Torah's dictates the people in effect reject Hashem.</point>
 
<point><b>Hashem's response: "כִּי אֹתִי מָאֲסוּ"</b> – In choosing a king who won't follow the Torah's dictates the people in effect reject Hashem.</point>
 
<point><b>Comparison to idolatry</b> – Hashem recognizes that such a king will turn the people away from Hashem and thus the request is similar to the people's history of idol worship.</point>
 
<point><b>Comparison to idolatry</b> – Hashem recognizes that such a king will turn the people away from Hashem and thus the request is similar to the people's history of idol worship.</point>
<point><b>Mishpat HaMelekh in Devarim versus Shemuel</b> – Since Torah calls for a constitutional monarchy, Devarim commands that a king must write his own Sefer Torah, highlighting how he, too, is subservient to the Torah's laws and not above them. In Sefer Shemuel, in contraat, the prophet warns the nation what an absolute monarch is like.&#160; He will extort the people and take of their property and children to serve him.</point>
+
<point><b>Mishpat HaMelekh in Devarim versus Shemuel</b> – Since Torah calls for a constitutional monarchy, Devarim commands that a king must write his own Sefer Torah, highlighting how he, too, is subservient to the Torah's laws and not above them. In Sefer Shemuel, in contrast, the prophet warns the nation what an absolute monarch is like.&#160; He will extort the people and take of their property and children to serve him.</point>
 
<point><b>Shemuel's speech in Chapter 12</b> – At the end of his speech, Shemuel repeatedly warns the people that if they listen to Hashem's laws then all will be well, but if they don't disaster will come.&#160; In this warning, Shemuel is in effect telling the nation that as long as their monarch abides by Torah law, and does not "judge like all the nations", Hashem will help them.</point>
 
<point><b>Shemuel's speech in Chapter 12</b> – At the end of his speech, Shemuel repeatedly warns the people that if they listen to Hashem's laws then all will be well, but if they don't disaster will come.&#160; In this warning, Shemuel is in effect telling the nation that as long as their monarch abides by Torah law, and does not "judge like all the nations", Hashem will help them.</point>
<point><b>Granting the request</b></point>
+
<point><b>Granting the request</b> – Hashem grants the request despite its problematic nature, and leaves it up to the nation to ensure that they do not stray and allow their king to abandon Torah.</point>
 
</category>
 
</category>
 
<category>Wrong Timing
 
<category>Wrong Timing
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<point><b>"שִׂימָה לָּנוּ מֶלֶךְ לְשׇׁפְטֵנוּ כְּכׇל הַגּוֹיִם"</b> – This position does not see anything wrong in either the content or manner of the request.</point>
 
<point><b>"שִׂימָה לָּנוּ מֶלֶךְ לְשׇׁפְטֵנוּ כְּכׇל הַגּוֹיִם"</b> – This position does not see anything wrong in either the content or manner of the request.</point>
 
<point><b>Why is the timing wrong?</b> Malbim explains that a king is only necessary in an era in which the people are living under the laws of nature and chance.&#160; In the time of Shemuel, however, there was miraculous providence, making such a position redundant.</point>
 
<point><b>Why is the timing wrong?</b> Malbim explains that a king is only necessary in an era in which the people are living under the laws of nature and chance.&#160; In the time of Shemuel, however, there was miraculous providence, making such a position redundant.</point>
<point><b>"כִּי תָבֹא אֶל הָאָרֶץ... וִירִשְׁתָּהּ וְיָשַׁבְתָּה בָּהּ"</b> – Malbim claims that the verses specify that the nation should only ask for a king after conquest and settlement, since beforehand Hashem's providence was very prevalent. Only afterwards, were there various time periods in which Hashem left the people to nature.</point>
+
<point><b>"כִּי תָבֹא אֶל הָאָרֶץ... וִירִשְׁתָּהּ וְיָשַׁבְתָּה בָּהּ"</b> – Malbim claims that the verses specify that the nation should only ask for a king after conquest and settlement, since beforehand Hashem's providence was very prevalent. Only afterwards were there various time periods in which Hashem left the people to nature.&#160;&#160; It was for such eras that the institution of monarchy was meant.</point>
 
<point><b>Hashem's response: "כִּי אֹתִי מָאֲסוּ"</b> – In choosing to forego providential leadership, the people turned their back on Hashem.</point>
 
<point><b>Hashem's response: "כִּי אֹתִי מָאֲסוּ"</b> – In choosing to forego providential leadership, the people turned their back on Hashem.</point>
 
<point><b>Supernatural signs</b> – In Chapter 12, Shemuel rebukes the people again for desiring a king, and accompanies his words with a supernatural sign.&#160; This served to remind the people that they had chosen to forsake miraculous leadership for natural government.<fn>See the Ran above who has a similar take on both the sign and the problems with a king.</fn></point>
 
<point><b>Supernatural signs</b> – In Chapter 12, Shemuel rebukes the people again for desiring a king, and accompanies his words with a supernatural sign.&#160; This served to remind the people that they had chosen to forsake miraculous leadership for natural government.<fn>See the Ran above who has a similar take on both the sign and the problems with a king.</fn></point>
 +
<point><b>Granting the request</b> – Since a king in itself is not negative, Hashem granted the request.</point>
 
</category>
 
</category>
 
</approaches>
 
</approaches>
 
</page>
 
</page>
 
</aht-xml>
 
</aht-xml>

Version as of 23:20, 23 November 2016

Problem With the King

Exegetical Approaches

This topic has not yet undergone editorial review

Rejection of Hashem for Human Military Leader

In requesting a human monarch to fight their wars, the people betrayed a lack of faith in and recognition of Hashem as their warrior and savior.

"וְיָצָא לְפָנֵינוּ וְנִלְחַם אֶת מִלְחֲמֹתֵנוּ" – Rashi and Radak point to these words of the nation as evidence that the people were not requesting a king who would serve a judicial purpose, but rather one who would act in a military capacity. They claim that this focus on the military aspect of the king's leadership is what troubled Hashem.
"שִׂימָה לָּנוּ מֶלֶךְ לְשׇׁפְטֵנוּ" – One might argue that in their initial request, the people actually make no mention of any military role, but only a judicial one (לְשׇׁפְטֵנוּ). Prof. Elitzur responds that the people were using the verb "שפט" in the military sense of the word,1 asking for a king who would serve as a שופט, like the leaders of the Book of Judges who were mainly saviors in war.
What is wrong with desiring a military leader?
  • Lack of trust – Radak asserts that the desire for a human warrior displays a lack of trust in Hashem to save the nation.
  • Attribution of success to self – In addition, having a king makes it likely that the people will attribute all their successes to their human leader2 as opposed to Hashem.3 This, in turn, will result in their not even turning to Hashem for aid when needed, as they replace Him with their new king.4 
  • Misconception as to causes of war – Prof. Elitzur adds that the request betrays the people's lack of understanding that wars and troubles come as a result of sin.5  The solution was not to find a king, but rather to repent and return to God.6
"כְּכָל הַגּוֹיִם" – These sources differ in how they evaluate this choice of language:
  • Problematic – Radak suggests that the people should not have asked for a king "like all the other nations" since they were not like other nations.  As long as they observed Hashem's laws, Hashem would fight for them.  Thus unlike others, Israel really did not need a warrior-king.
  • Not problematic – Prof. Elitzur, in contrast, sees nothing wrong in this formulation pointing out that it is identical to Hashem's language in Devarim. In fact, the people of Shemuel's time might simply be echoing Hashem's own words.
"וַיֵּרַע הַדָּבָר בְּעֵינֵי שְׁמוּאֵל כַּאֲשֶׁר אָמְרוּ תְּנָה לָּנוּ מֶלֶךְ לְשׇׁפְטֵנוּ" – This position could explain Shemuel's reaction in one of two ways:
  • It is possible that Shemuel understood the people correctly, (with "שפט" having a military connotation) and, like Hashem, was upset that the nation wanted to replace their old warrior, Hashem, with a new one.
  • Alternatively, it is possible that Shemuel misunderstood the people's request, understanding "לְשׇׁפְטֵנוּ" in its judicial sense. He took their request as a personal affront, as he assumed that they found him lacking.
Hashem's response: "כִּי אֹתִי מָאֲסוּ" – According to the approach that Shemuel misunderstood the people's request, Hashem here corrects Shemuel's misconception and explains that the people's desire for a king is really a rejection of Hashem, not Shemuel.
Comparison to idolatry – Since the monarchy means that the people depend on their king rather than Hashem, it is similar to idolatry.7  It, too, will eventually lead the people to forsake Hashem.
"כֵּן הֵמָּה עֹשִׂים גַּם לָךְ" – According to Radak, in these words Hashem tells Shemuel that the people actually did rebel against the prophet as well, but in his military rather than judicial role.  Until now the prophet had led them in battle by bringing them back to Hashem.  In fact, he was so successful that they were hardly threatened by war anymore. Thus, in asking for a king, the people were rejecting both Hashem and Shemuel.
Positive mentions of monarchy
  • Prof Elitzur claims that the Torah is not against monarchy per se, only against the hopes the people put into the change of regime.8
  • Alternatively, in Devarim (and elsewhere) Hashem is referring to a king whose primary role was not military in nature but judicial or spiritual. Such a monarch would not have been problematic, yet, even so, Hashem enacts laws to curb his power and remind him that he is subservient to Hashem.  Otherwise there is a fear that he will become haughty and see himself as a replacement for Hashem, leading him and the nation to depend on the monarch and not God.
Shemuel's speech when anointing Shaul – When Shemuel appoints Shaul as king, he reminds the people that it is Hashem, not their new king, who is their true savior:  "וְאַתֶּם הַיּוֹם מְאַסְתֶּם אֶת אֱלֹהֵיכֶם אֲשֶׁר הוּא מוֹשִׁיעַ לָכֶם מִכׇּל רָעוֹתֵיכֶם וְצָרֹתֵיכֶם וַתֹּאמְרוּ לוֹ כִּי מֶלֶךְ תָּשִׂים עָלֵינוּ" (Shemuel I 10:18-20). This further supports this position's understanding of the people's flawed request.
Shemuel's speech in Chapter 12 – Throughout his speech, Shemuel brings examples of how, in the past, when the Israelites found themselves in danger, they would cry out to Hashem, recognizing that they had sinned. This, he hints, is what they were supposed to do. Similarly, Shemuel might intentionally bring a sign from non-seasonal rain since, in Torah, rain and the lack thereof is a barometer of the people's observance of Hashem's commandments (the true reason for military success) and a reminder of our dependence upon Him.
Parallel to Gidon – After Gidon's victory over Midyan, the people make the same mistake they do here, requesting that Gidon lead them as king because "you saved us from Midyan".  Gidon refuses, teaching the nation: "לֹא אֶמְשֹׁל אֲנִי בָּכֶם וְלֹא יִמְשֹׁל בְּנִי בָּכֶם י"י יִמְשֹׁל בָּכֶם" (Shofetim 8:22-23).
Granting a king – If Hashem thought that having a military-monarch was dangerous for the people spiritually, it is not clear why He agreed to the request.

Rejection of the Shofet

The people's desire for a king "to judge us" was problematic either because it usurped the institution of judges as a whole, or because it was a personal affront to Shemuel specifically.

Insult to Shemuel

Though there is nothing wrong with the institution of monarchy, asking for a king to serve as a judge when Shemuel was still judging the nation was an insult to his honor.

"לְשׇׁפְטֵנוּ" – These sources all pick up on the nation's request "שִׂימָה לָּנוּ מֶלֶךְ לְשׇׁפְטֵנוּ", claiming that Shemuel is upset specifically by the people's request  for a king who "will judge us."9
Shemuel's sons – The fact that the people preface their request for a king with their complaints about Shemuel's sons not following in their father's way,10 supports the idea that their request for a king stemmed from a desire to replace Shemuel and his family.11
Shemuel's speech in Chapter 12 – The first half of Shemuel's speech is devoted to Shemuel's insistence that he was always honest in his dealings with the nation.  This focus further supports the idea that Shemuel had felt that the people doubted his abilities and functioning as a judge.
"כְּכָל הַגּוֹיִם" – These sources see nothing wrong in the desire "to be like the nations". After all, in Devarim when Hashem speaks of appointing a king, He Himself says that the people will request a king "like all the nations".  Moreover, if this was problematic either Shemuel or Hashem should have emphasized that aspect of the request in their speech.
Hashem's response: "כִּי אֹתִי מָאֲסוּ" – Hashem's response to Shemuel "כִּי לֹא אֹתְךָ מָאָסוּ כִּי אֹתִי מָאֲסוּ" would seem to go against this position as it suggests that Hashem does not see in the nation's request an affront to Shemuel.  The Hoil Moshe explains that Hashem isn't denying the insult, but comforting Shemuel by telling him that the people treat Hashem the same way, constantly turning away from Him and choosing idols in His place.  Thus, Shemuel should not take it unduly to heart:  "דיו לעבד שיהיה כרבו".  Hoil Moshe further proves that Hashem isn't trying to dismiss Shemuel's concerns from His final words, "כֵּן הֵמָּה עֹשִׂים גַּם לָךְ".
Positive mentions of monarchy – The fact that monarchy is viewed positively in Torah and the Book of Judges is not problematic for this position as these sources agree that the monarchy is a desired institution.  In Sefer Shemuel, the anger at the nation comes not from the content of the people's request but from the manner in which they ask it.
Granting a king – Hashem granted the request since there was really nothing wrong with asking for a monarch.  The people's sin was only an interpersonal one.
Shemuel and Shaul

Usurping the Role of Judges

The nation's request was problematic because they wanted a king to fulfill a judicial rather than a political or military role .

"לְשׇׁפְטֵנוּ" – As above, these sources note that Shemuel focuses specifically on the nation's request "שִׂימָה לָּנוּ מֶלֶךְ לְשׇׁפְטֵנוּ", proving that what he found problematic was the desire for a king who "will judge us."12
Shemuel's sons – The people's request for a king comes on the back of their complaints about Shemuel's sons.  This further supports the assertion that they desired a king who would serve in the capacity of judge.
What is wrong with a king who judges? The Ran explains that a king's tasks are political and military, while the judge's job is spiritual.  The latter necessitates having a Divine spark (ענין אלהי) which the monarch might be lacking.  As such, the two positions were meant to remain distinct.13
"כְּכָל הַגּוֹיִם" – According to this approach neither Shemuel nor Hashem were upset by the nation's choice of language, "to be like the nations".
Hashem's response: "כִּי אֹתִי מָאֲסוּ" – The Ran explains that Hashem is telling Shemuel that in asking for a purely political ruler to take on a spiritual role, the people were denying the need for a "Divine spark" and thus rejecting Hashem.
Monarchy in Devarim – Ibn Kaspi points out that since Devarim 16 and Devarim 17 speak of two distinct institutions, that of judges and that of kings, it is evident that an Israelite monarch was not supposed to serve as both.  Had the people asked for a king without elaboration, or one that would serve a military role, Shemuel and Hashem would not have resisted, since that was the original intention and command.14
Shemuel's speech in Chapter 12 – Shemuel focuses much of his speech on his honest dealings as judge, perhaps to highlight to the people what they will be missing when they have a politically minded king play that role in his stead.  The Ran suggests that Shemuel brings a miraculous sign (a thunderstorm out of season) to show that an individual with a Divine park is not subject to the laws of nature, again highlighting what a judge-king will lack.
Granting a king – According to the Ran, after Shemeul's rebuke, the people changed their request, this time adding that the king must play a military role: "וְיָצָא לְפָנֵינוּ וְנִלְחַם אֶת מִלְחֲמֹתֵנוּ". Though they were not willing to totally forego a judge-king, they at least made concessions due to Shemuel's rebuke, and so Hashem granted their request.

Rejection of Torah Law

Hashem was upset by the people's request since they desired a king who would be like the other nations and not subject to the laws of Torah.

"כְּכָל הַגּוֹיִם" – These sources focus on the people's request that they have a king "like the other nations," understanding this to mean that they desired a king who would act like Gentile rulers, deciding the law on his own rather than following Torah law.15  Thus, while the Torah speaks of a constitutional monarchy, the people requested an absolute monarchy.
The command to appoint a king in Devarim – One may question how asking to be "like the nations" could be problematic if Hashem uses the very same language when speaking of anointing a king in Devarim. Malbim responds that in Devarim, the phrase "כְּכׇל הַגּוֹיִם" is linked to the words "אָשִׂימָה עָלַי מֶלֶךְ" so Hashem is simply saying that the people will want to appoint a monarch just as other nations have such a leader.  In Shemuel, however, the words "כְּכׇל הַגּוֹיִם" refer back to the verb "לְשׇׁפְטֵנוּ" which changes the people's intent totally, for here they are instead asking for a king whose judgement will be like that of other nations.
"לְשׇׁפְטֵנוּ" – This approach must explain why, when the verses describes Shemuel's distress at the people's request, they make no mention of the fact that the nation desired a king "like all the nations" emphasizing instead that they wanted one to "judge" them. These sources respond that Shemuel mentions the aspect of judgement, since this is the area in which the king won't be abiding by Torah law, as he will, instead, be making his own code.
Hashem's response: "כִּי אֹתִי מָאֲסוּ" – In choosing a king who won't follow the Torah's dictates the people in effect reject Hashem.
Comparison to idolatry – Hashem recognizes that such a king will turn the people away from Hashem and thus the request is similar to the people's history of idol worship.
Mishpat HaMelekh in Devarim versus Shemuel – Since Torah calls for a constitutional monarchy, Devarim commands that a king must write his own Sefer Torah, highlighting how he, too, is subservient to the Torah's laws and not above them. In Sefer Shemuel, in contrast, the prophet warns the nation what an absolute monarch is like.  He will extort the people and take of their property and children to serve him.
Shemuel's speech in Chapter 12 – At the end of his speech, Shemuel repeatedly warns the people that if they listen to Hashem's laws then all will be well, but if they don't disaster will come.  In this warning, Shemuel is in effect telling the nation that as long as their monarch abides by Torah law, and does not "judge like all the nations", Hashem will help them.
Granting the request – Hashem grants the request despite its problematic nature, and leaves it up to the nation to ensure that they do not stray and allow their king to abandon Torah.

Wrong Timing

Though there is nothing inherently wrong with the institution of monarchy, in this era of miraculous providence, there was no need for a king.

"שִׂימָה לָּנוּ מֶלֶךְ לְשׇׁפְטֵנוּ כְּכׇל הַגּוֹיִם" – This position does not see anything wrong in either the content or manner of the request.
Why is the timing wrong? Malbim explains that a king is only necessary in an era in which the people are living under the laws of nature and chance.  In the time of Shemuel, however, there was miraculous providence, making such a position redundant.
"כִּי תָבֹא אֶל הָאָרֶץ... וִירִשְׁתָּהּ וְיָשַׁבְתָּה בָּהּ" – Malbim claims that the verses specify that the nation should only ask for a king after conquest and settlement, since beforehand Hashem's providence was very prevalent. Only afterwards were there various time periods in which Hashem left the people to nature.   It was for such eras that the institution of monarchy was meant.
Hashem's response: "כִּי אֹתִי מָאֲסוּ" – In choosing to forego providential leadership, the people turned their back on Hashem.
Supernatural signs – In Chapter 12, Shemuel rebukes the people again for desiring a king, and accompanies his words with a supernatural sign.  This served to remind the people that they had chosen to forsake miraculous leadership for natural government.17
Granting the request – Since a king in itself is not negative, Hashem granted the request.